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East_African
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 10:41 |
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| I caught something about non english people not respecting it on the letters section in the metro.What are your thoughts on this?
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stick-upKid
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 10:44 |
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i've not seen anyone wearing it, except for tv sport pundits
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Black_Power
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 10:50 |
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| got one here... but think wearing symbols is a load of rubbish.
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babygirl44
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 10:54 |
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I used to wear one in school but thats because we were made to. I have nothing against wearing it but I'm not going out of my my way to find out where to buy one either. I would feel happier to wear it if the whites acknowledged how many non-whites also died and contributedto the world wars. They make no mention of the achievements of non-whites in the war (Caribbean, Africa and India) but want to get vexed when many non-whites can't be bothered to buy a poppy.
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Mezmerized
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 11:21 |
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What for?
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misunderstood2006
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 15:09 |
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Hell no!
My friend used to work for the West Indian Ex service men's Association (not quite sure if that is the correct name) and they applied to the Royal British Legion to become affiliated, which would of mean't some much needed money etc for the veterans. They were repeatedly told no.....remember at the time of the wars Jamaica (most were from there) at least was "British", from what I told was they were numerous times they were turned down. From when I heard that over 10 years ago I vowed never to buy/wear a poppy and have not done so and will not!
This is aside from the fact that the "Legion" is no predisposed to non whites! As whites were the only ones that fought and died in their wars!!!
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Le Moor
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 16:19 |
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Support for the British Establishment?
What about all the black serviceman who died fighting Hitler?
Last edited on Saturday November 11th, 2006 04:12 by Le Moor
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Apedemak
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 16:40 |
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They hardly get a mention & unless they were fighting for their own countries I'm not too bothered.
Last edited on Friday November 10th, 2006 16:41 by Apedemak
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Le Moor
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 18:01 |
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Rebel-Lion wrote: They hardly get a mention & unless they were fighting for their own countries I'm not too bothered.
Yes me lion.....lol
So if there was another Hitler, you wouldnt fight in the British Army i take it...?
Last edited on Friday November 10th, 2006 20:35 by Le Moor
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The Watcher
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 18:13 |
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Le Moor
It's not just a symbollic thing but a fundraiser for those old servicemen and their pensions, homes etc. So the question isn't about supporting establishment but if you feel like supporting these guys. Which I guess is up to you. Those guys fought Hitler and them.
As for the "establishment" we ALL support them with taxes  Each one of us living and working here is supporting the "establishment". All those tanks and guns and toys in Iraq? That's us dude.
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MarcusGarveyLives
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 18:17 |
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... meet 'another Hitler' ...
... no-one wears poppies for the Africans that died at his hands - rather some Africans paid 'tribute' to him when he died!
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Le Moor
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 20:05 |
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The Watcher wrote: Le Moor
It's not just a symbollic thing but a fundraiser for those old servicemen and their pensions, homes etc. So the question isn't about supporting establishment but if you feel like supporting these guys. Which I guess is up to you. Those guys fought Hitler and them.
As for the "establishment" we ALL support them with taxes Each one of us living and working here is supporting the "establishment". All those tanks and guns and toys in Iraq? That's us dude.
I agree. For the record i wouldnt fight in the Army, not even against another Hitler. And i dont do poppies either.
I saw a brother wearing one recently and just got me thinking," i wonder if he's confused, has a valid reason for wearing it, or is just doing the when in Rome thingy".
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Apedemak
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 20:14 |
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^ @MGL god man, that pic is too big, assulting my retina like that 
Le Moor
It's not just a symbollic thing but a fundraiser for those old servicemen and their pensions, homes etc. So the question isn't about supporting establishment but if you feel like supporting these guys. Which I guess is up to you. Those guys fought Hitler and them.
As for the "establishment" we ALL support them with taxes Each one of us living and working here is supporting the "establishment". All those tanks and guns and toys in Iraq? That's us dude.
.lol.
Exactly... its; for those old servicemen and their pensions, homes etc and for those guys as you say. If the europeans were smart they'd ask why their war ''heros'' aren't being looked after by the state already rather than being left to beg the public to buy paper versions of the flowers growing on their dead friends graves. All to pay for old folks homes and their pensions. How ironic.
Hitler wasn't defeated, we're just living under a new form of 'Nazism', the Jews are happy doing what they were back in Germany only worldwide and we (including a few others) are still the victims of the europeans apparent supremecy over everyone else... all friendly with the Zionists no doubt.
MGL had it with Bosa, there were more like him probably a 'friends of Hitler' club somewhere. BlackPower posted up another in the Roots room.
If it was insane far right radicalism they were fighting they lost. Stupid old war veterans probably still call us N****rs and a Jew a Yid same way.
Last edited on Friday November 10th, 2006 20:20 by Apedemak
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The Watcher
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 20:34 |
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If the europeans were smart they'd ask why their war ''heros'' aren't being looked after by the state already rather than being left to beg the public to buy paper versions of the flowers growing on their dead friends graves. All to pay for old folks homes and their pensions. How ironic.
Now that's real right there. Old people ain't worth sh*t in Britain.
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Apedemak
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 20:50 |
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And its wrong... not being all disrespectful to old folks but if thats what paper poppies are for then why on earth are their war heros still on a version of welfare? Why dosen't the government look after the people who are prepared to go off and die for (german) Queen and country?
Thats wrong.
I mean theres WW1 and WW2 programs playing constantly on their history programs... why aren't they being looked after already?
That and the situation old folks find themselves in is more down to the rising population, high debt rates and what not adding to that distrust and the lack of community spirit in a monetarily focused do for self society. The area I'm in used to be kinda villiage like, its more high streetish now... heck, a man in his mid 20s could probably fall over and get trampled in central.
Wasn't being disrespectful, even to old probably racist war veterans.
Last edited on Friday November 10th, 2006 20:52 by Apedemak
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Dada
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 23:30 |
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Obviously as an Ex Service man I wear a poppy. I do so for past and present members of HMF Black,White or Brown. They deserve it for their Valour,Duty ,selflessness and Service.
When I was younger I used to think it was about wearing it to commerate our involvement in World War I & II.
But, now I realise that both those wars (of which Britain declared war on Germany not the other way around) were wars of Protecting the Empire. Which ironically even though Britain won, she did so at the expense of that which she sought to protect and perserve. That's always the irony of war , that of what one fights for usually gets changed due to the conflict. A war closer to my home (The Falklands) ended up with thousands of Servicemen and Women on previously sparsely inhabited islands changing the lives and nature of the people we sought to protect at GREAT EXPENSE to the Tax payer and 280 dead in 7 weeks! not the 130 odd over 3 years the Media bangs on about in Iraq. 
But that's is on the political wider stage. I wear the poppy for those that lived and died on the principle of:
"Ours is not to reason why, ours is just to do and die"
So people can safely say I don't give two F**Ks whether you did or not.
As LCorporal Beharry V.C would testify with his horrific injuries. 
Last edited on Friday November 10th, 2006 23:39 by Dada
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RasRuben
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Posted: Friday November 10th, 2006 23:50 |
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http://www.ligali.org/article.php?id=371
In case anyone wants to wear their poppy.
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Kunjufu
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Posted: Saturday November 11th, 2006 00:07 |
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Nope don't wear a Poppy, and i don't do the two minute silent bit either....whilst i respect any man willing to pick up a gun for his beliefs... I'm not giving up my time for an evil Empire...
If i may i also agree with John Snow, who called certain people Poppy Fascist for maoning that he does not wear a poppy in screen when he reads the news....
I think they are out of order and misguided to complain
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The Watcher
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Posted: Saturday November 11th, 2006 00:23 |
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Dada wrote: Obviously as an Ex Service man I wear a poppy. I do so for past and present members of HMF Black,White or Brown. They deserve it for their Valour,Duty ,selflessness and Service.
When I was younger I used to think it was about wearing it to commerate our involvement in World War I & II.
But, now I realise that both those wars (of which Britain declared war on Germany not the other way around) were wars of Protecting the Empire. Which ironically even though Britain won, she did so at the expense of that which she sought to protect and perserve. That's always the irony of war , that of what one fights for usually gets changed due to the conflict. A war closer to my home (The Falklands) ended up with thousands of Servicemen and Women on previously sparsely inhabited islands changing the lives and nature of the people we sought to protect at GREAT EXPENSE to the Tax payer and 280 dead in 7 weeks! not the 130 odd over 3 years the Media bangs on about in Iraq.
But that's is on the political wider stage. I wear the poppy for those that lived and died on the principle of:
"Ours is not to reason why, ours is just to do and die"
So people can safely say I don't give two F**Ks whether you did or not.
As LCorporal Beharry V.C would testify with his horrific injuries.
I reckon you got that a lil backwards. While you're right that WW1 was certainly an empire thing and European collective greed, I doubt Britains involvement in WW2 was. Do your history. Chamberlain mad a coward of himself and Britain doing all they possibly could to appease Hitler. They didn't want that war dude. Britain had allies it was sworn and legally obliged to protect in Europe like the Czechs and Poles yet they did bugger all when Hitler roled over them. It took ages and a direct threat to get them going. What happened AFTER the war with roosevelt, stalin and churchill... And Churchill easily the loser (though they won the war). Nasser later put the nail in the coffin of the empire. Not WW2. And though I suspect the Falklands is where you might have fought that was DEFINATELY an empire thing. Britain had no business and no right being there and it was a stupid war. That was a disgrace! Am suprised Reagan allowed Thatcher to get away with that nonsense.
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Kunjufu
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Posted: Saturday November 11th, 2006 00:32 |
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Watcher: hate to say this but I think you'll find that WW2 was actually about empires and the Japanese Italians and Germanies determination to break into the Empire cartel of America, Europe and Asia....
If you remember Germay in order to reestablish itself, invaded Spain, Checkslovakia (spelling) and the Poland... the Uk offered Checkslovakia as an offering.. Gernmany rejectec this and then invaded the rest of Europe anyway...
If you also remember Italty not only invaded Ethopia it massarce thousands right under the noses of the league of Nations (forerunner to the UN) in the Thirties... Mussolini had asperations to recreat the Roman empire in the 40's..
The Japanese had her sights on the Far East, and attacked American because it had blocked its apirations in places like China to name one key area...
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The Watcher
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Posted: Saturday November 11th, 2006 00:44 |
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Kunjufu wrote: Watcher: hate to say this but I think you'll find that WW2 was actually about empires and the Japanese Italians and Germanies determination to break into the Empire cartel of America, Europe and Asia....
If you remember Germay in order to reestablish itself, invaded Spain, Checkslovakia (spelling) and the Poland... the Uk offered Checkslovakia as an offering.. Gernmany rejectec this and then invaded the rest of Europe anyway...
If you also remember Italty not only invaded Ethopia it massarce thousands right under the noses of the league of Nations (forerunner to the UN) in the Thirties... Mussolini had asperations to recreat the Roman empire in the 40's..
The Japanese had her sights on the Far East, and attacked American because it had blocked its apirations in places like China to name one key area...
Let me get my thoughts in order. In the east Japan had been fighting WW2 before 1939 and that expansion was already threatening Britain's interests hence the fighting in Burma, India, east China etc. In Africa you're right Musolini was making moves but without the later assistance from Hitler (Rommel) I don't think he would have made any impact whatsoever. But I wasn't meaning Musolini and Hirohito when I said that.
But with my comments to Dada I was refering mainly to the direct war on the European continent which Britain wanted no part of. France often (wrongly imo) get depitcted as the cowards of WW2 despite losing the most soldiers of any of the allies but Britain went to massive diplomatic lengths to make nice with Hitler and stop that European war.
I don't think WW2 was about empire. Even accepting that it was, Britain was in no way the aggressor. They simply had way too much to lose.
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jett Black
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Posted: Saturday November 11th, 2006 17:13 |
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Yeah I wear one.....in my ass!!!
Kunjufu said----If i may i also agree with John Snow, who called certain people Poppy Fascist for maoning that he does not wear a poppy in screen when he reads the news....
I think they are out of order and misguided to complain
Yeah he's the same guy who turned down the OBE,MBE nonsense too and explained why..one of the few establishment who actually know what time it is.!
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Peacemaker
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Posted: Saturday November 11th, 2006 19:50 |
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East_African wrote: I caught something about non english people not respecting it on the letters section in the metro.What are your thoughts on this?
Poppy money goes to charity right? Probably to help old people live longer. f**k that.
Besides I've got nothing that goes with red, also I don't quite fancy putting tiny holes in my rather expensive jumper.
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Dada
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Posted: Saturday November 11th, 2006 22:35 |
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1. If britain declared war on Germany over Poland it would follow that the endgame of The USSR occupying Poland meant that the reasons for war were futile.
2. In no way was Japan a threat to Britain. Only it's colonies.
3. Britain chose to fight Germany over a Balance of Power issue, a centuries old polic y amoung France,Germany and Britain dating back long the French Revolution.
4. It was only a World War because colonial Powers brought in armies from thier colonies, and used thier colonies resources to fight an essentially european war, except ofcourse point 2.
5. In regards to the Falklands War I would say that any country wishing to be respected on the world stage as Britain did and tries to would not tolerate a minor regional power invading by force of arms territories it is pledge to protect. It was not a Colonial war, rather a politically UNTENABLE position for any elected government that has it's national interest and international standing to consider.
Other than that I will not bother to argue over things that have more meaning for me beyond an arm chair interest\knowledge. you are entitled to your opinion as others are.
6. The Soviet Union which lost 22 Million of it's People in WWII would concur to futher in accurate statements such as:
"France often (wrongly imo) get depitcted as the cowards of WW2 despite losing the most soldiers of any of the allies "
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