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Le Moor
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Posted: Tuesday October 3rd, 2006 17:26 |
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If you knew during early pregnancy that your baby had down Syndrone, would you still give birth or have the child aborted?
(to any mothers/fathers out there who have DS kids i trust the wording i have just used does not cause offence. Its a question however which is a real choice some have had to face no doubt)
Im of the thinking if this were to happen to me i would most definatley keep the child and love them same way.
Last edited on Tuesday October 3rd, 2006 17:29 by Le Moor
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The Watcher
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Posted: Tuesday October 3rd, 2006 17:37 |
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| No. I got a DS cousin and wouldn't contemplate something like that at all. I doubt even those who would, would admit such a thing though
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Shemsi en Tehuti
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Posted: Tuesday October 3rd, 2006 17:37 |
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I would abort, if it were copacetic with my future wife.. I don't see a fetus as "alive" until it can survive on its own outside of the mothers body. Therefore, it is not a living person, only an extension of the mother. I am all for reproductive rights of the mother and father.
The reason I would abort should be obvious. If it can be avoided, I think it is cruel to bring a life into this world fully knowing they will suffer from disease and there is nothing you or the child can do to prevent it.
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CeeCee
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Posted: Tuesday October 3rd, 2006 17:49 |
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LeMoor,
I cannot say what I would or wouldn't do, although I do not think I could abort my child for a couple of reasons 1) I was always taught that abortion is wrong( Unless it threatens your life 2) A friend personal experiences with it convinces me not to. Her doctor told her that if she has another abortion that she was going to be infertile 3) I wonder what would that child be like. Whether the child has /don't have downs syndrome, they are human beings also. Sometimes I get irked at people who say they get abortions and classify the fetus as "nothing" I wondered would they say if their parents called them that?
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Kibibi
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Posted: Tuesday October 3rd, 2006 18:35 |
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I would like to say that I wouldn't and that I would keep the child regardless, but in all honesty I don't really know. There are different levels of severity and I don't know if I could truly cope with a severly disabled child.
But that's me saying that now, I could change my mind in a few years time.
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AmeriJamCan
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Posted: Wednesday October 4th, 2006 18:28 |
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Don't know. I have seen many DS children flourish and live long lives. But at the same time, I would have to be prepared to go the extra mile in raising a child that would have a permanent, non-curable disabling condition. Don't know if I could deal with that. It's hard enough to raise healthy children, nevertheless a mentally challenged child.
Having said that, my sister adopted a mentally challenged girl - she's lovely!! So, can't say what I would do if I faced that reality. I wouldn't look down on people who choose abortion in such situations.
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Kunjufu
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Posted: Wednesday October 4th, 2006 20:19 |
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| answer: no..to abort for that reason would be a wicked and EVIL thing to do!!!
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Sistren
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Posted: Wednesday October 4th, 2006 21:08 |
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| is it not an extension of the father too?
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Shemsi en Tehuti
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Posted: Thursday October 5th, 2006 13:09 |
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Kunjufu wrote: answer: no..to abort for that reason would be a wicked and EVIL thing to do!!!
Is there ever a valid (not evil) reason to abort a child in your mind?
Last edited on Thursday October 5th, 2006 13:11 by Shemsi en Tehuti
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Shemsi en Tehuti
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Posted: Thursday October 5th, 2006 13:10 |
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Sistren wrote: is it not an extension of the father too?
Of course it is. However, I would be interesting to see the day when a man could tell the woman i the middle of her pregnancy, "you know what, I really don't want this child" and then be able to force her to terminate the pregnancy.
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Melissa
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Posted: Thursday October 5th, 2006 13:53 |
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Shemsi en Tehuti wrote: Kunjufu wrote: answer: no..to abort for that reason would be a wicked and EVIL thing to do!!!
Is there ever a valid (not evil) reason to abort a child in your mind?
If the preganancy was a result of rape or sexual abuse maybe .
I wouldn't abort the child now, but if I was a younger person it would be something I would consider.
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Shemsi en Tehuti
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Posted: Thursday October 5th, 2006 13:59 |
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| So how is bringing new life into this world knowingly with a deformity or serious defect not cruel? How is it not inhumane? How is it not unethical. How is it not uncivil?
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Apedemak
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Posted: Thursday October 5th, 2006 14:16 |
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Most people would speak from their inability to raise a downsyndrome child than anything as in they wouldn't want to raise one. Its all about designer pickney.
Bet no one knows what downsyndrome is about other than it being disfiguring and horrible to look at let alone push down the street.
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Vezz.
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Posted: Thursday October 5th, 2006 15:24 |
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Hubby says abort but I'm not so sure.
People have been saying it's inhumane to bring a child like this into the world, but they would know no difference.
It's not like the child was normal, then was struck by illness or knocked over and left with brain damage.
This is about whether the parents could cope, because if the child is loved and nurtured it will flourish - just like any child would.
I couldn't abort a child...even if it was conceived out of rape, for example, because it's not the child's fault, so why kill it?
From the first scan where you see the foetus moving, that is my child, and to kill it would be a travesty.
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Melissa
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Posted: Thursday October 5th, 2006 16:13 |
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Vezz. wrote: Hubby says abort but I'm not so sure.
People have been saying it's inhumane to bring a child like this into the world, but they would know no difference.
It's not like the child was normal, then was struck by illness or knocked over and left with brain damage.
This is about whether the parents could cope, because if the child is loved and nurtured it will flourish - just like any child would.
I couldn't abort a child...even if it was conceived out of rape, for example, because it's not the child's fault, so why kill it?
From the first scan where you see the foetus moving, that is my child, and to kill it would be a travesty.
Same reason i wouldn't do the same thing now, but I know I thought about this when i was pregnant the first time and said no way! It was daunting enough to be pregnant much less anything else.
Its wrong to think of a child as nothing but cells before it is actually born, they say the childs personality is built in the womb.
And what if an illness is not detected during pregnancy, one which would have made you abort the child, what then? Give the child up? I couldn't be that wicked personally.
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Saida.M
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Posted: Friday October 6th, 2006 12:09 |
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How can anyone say they are not a burden?
Imagine you're ninety and you have a sixty year old child you STILL have to look after!
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Apedemak
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Posted: Friday October 6th, 2006 12:57 |
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Yeah, easier to get on in life without a disabled child clinging to your breast. Definately best to poision it before it takes shape and flush it down the toilet.
Down syndrome is one thing... what about a blind child? Or a deaf one? Prehaps one with a marrow problem that can't walk... would people still feel the same way or are those more common 'ailments' easier to deal with? Nicer looking pickney those ones.
Thing is theres a downsyndrome kid at a meeting I go to every now and then, hes happy running around the place making noise.
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Shemsi en Tehuti
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Posted: Friday October 6th, 2006 13:52 |
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Ok, even though things don't always work out how we plan them, we need to ask a more cultural philosophical question. What purpose do we serve in having children? Why do we have them?
I know in traditional Chinese (and other cultures), the children are seen as an investment or insurance to take care fo the parents in old age. The children literally must come back to live at home after making a life and finding a spouse. How much insurance would a mentally retarded or genetically disabled child be to a parent? In this case, the child is only a liability to both the parents and him or her self. If this isn't how you see things, then please share. What do you think is the purpose of having children?
Last edited on Friday October 6th, 2006 13:54 by Shemsi en Tehuti
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Apedemak
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Posted: Friday October 6th, 2006 14:28 |
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What do you think is the purpose of having children?
Good question, would make an intresting topic...
To use them as mini projects, arming them against the babylonious system. Feeding them the escoteric instead of standard foods.
Breed a super breed of pickney 
If my wife was set to have a down syndrome child I'd probably put it up for adoption.
The main reason for having a kid is to continue the line.
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Saida.M
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Posted: Friday October 6th, 2006 15:33 |
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Rebel-Lion wrote:
Yeah, easier to get on in life without a disabled child clinging to your breast. Definately best to poision it before it takes shape and flush it down the toilet.
Down syndrome is one thing... what about a blind child? Or a deaf one? Prehaps one with a marrow problem that can't walk... would people still feel the same way or are those more common 'ailments' easier to deal with? Nicer looking pickney those ones.
Thing is theres a downsyndrome kid at a meeting I go to every now and then, hes happy running around the place making noise.
Not saying people should abort - just pointing out that it's not all a bed of rose.
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Melissa
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Posted: Friday October 6th, 2006 15:38 |
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Saida.M wrote: Rebel-Lion wrote:
Yeah, easier to get on in life without a disabled child clinging to your breast. Definately best to poision it before it takes shape and flush it down the toilet.
Down syndrome is one thing... what about a blind child? Or a deaf one? Prehaps one with a marrow problem that can't walk... would people still feel the same way or are those more common 'ailments' easier to deal with? Nicer looking pickney those ones.
Thing is theres a downsyndrome kid at a meeting I go to every now and then, hes happy running around the place making noise.
Not saying people should abort - just pointing out that it's not all a bed of rose.
...or black people either.
What point were you trying to make?
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Saida.M
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Posted: Friday October 6th, 2006 15:45 |
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Melissa wrote: Saida.M wrote: Rebel-Lion wrote:
Yeah, easier to get on in life without a disabled child clinging to your breast. Definately best to poision it before it takes shape and flush it down the toilet.
Down syndrome is one thing... what about a blind child? Or a deaf one? Prehaps one with a marrow problem that can't walk... would people still feel the same way or are those more common 'ailments' easier to deal with? Nicer looking pickney those ones.
Thing is theres a downsyndrome kid at a meeting I go to every now and then, hes happy running around the place making noise.
Not saying people should abort - just pointing out that it's not all a bed of rose.
...or black people either.
What point were you trying to make?
Breed a super breed of pickney
Just picking up on what RL said.
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Sistren
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Posted: Friday October 6th, 2006 23:25 |
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Shemsi en Tehuti wrote: Sistren wrote: is it not an extension of the father too?
Of course it is. However, I would be interesting to see the day when a man could tell the woman i the middle of her pregnancy, "you know what, I really don't want this child" and then be able to force her to terminate the pregnancy.
your argument seemed to be that an early pregnacy was merely an extension of the mother - therfore dimissable on those grounds.. I was merely questioning tat viewpoint
The middle of a pregnancy is 20 weeks! Most terminations are carried out before the 14th week of pregnancy.
It would be fairly difficult to get an abortion 20 weeks barring medical reasons - much less for a man to FORCE a woman to have an abortion.
I don't see what would be interesting about it.
If a couple choose to terminate a pregnancy - that is their bizniz - but a pregnancy is viable now from 24 weeks - with medical support even 22 and 23 weekers have survived.
I would not relish the thought of raising a DS child - a "normal" healthy child is enogh of a challenge. Nor do I know that I would be emotionally, physically or spiritually able to cope with the challenge....... what I do believe is that we are seldom given more that we can bear
But people are individuals and have the right to choose. If someone goes ahead and knowing has a DS child more power to them. Likewise if an individual decides to terminate.............. they have to live with their decision and if it is morally wrong or a sin........I'm a firm bliever in letting he or she who is without sin cast the first stone.
I don't believe in Big sin and small sin
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saywone1
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Posted: Saturday October 7th, 2006 00:27 |
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I think it depends on the mentality of the person and family of the person having the baby and their situation.
Like Rebel Lion said, everybady want designer pickney it seems. It seems the "hastle" of bringing up a mentally challenged child is too, well, challenging for some folk. Either because they worried about what other people think, its embarrassing, they havent got the time or money for extra resources for that child, or they are just simply clueless about what to do and how to raise a child like that.
Morally aborting a human life just doesnt sit right with me but I understand some peoples reasons.
What I think is sad and I hate about england and its society is that we are all mental victims of its 'culture'.
Do you think this would happen in a completely different culture/society?
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Apedemak
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Posted: Monday October 9th, 2006 17:21 |
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I don't even know what I'd do, I'd feel bad putting the kid up for adoption. Couldn't live with myself especially as I know what its like to not have a parent around, even if its on a small scale.
Wouldn't be surprised if theres homes full of old and disabled people, people that people don't want.
It seems the "hastle" of bringing up a mentally challenged child is too, well, challenging for some folk. Either because they worried about what other people think, its embarrassing, they havent got the time or money for extra resources for that child, or they are just simply clueless about what to do and how to raise a child like that.
Morally aborting a human life just doesnt sit right with me but I understand some peoples reasons.
What I think is sad and I hate about england and its society is that we are all mental victims of its 'culture'.
Do you think this would happen in a completely different culture/society?
No.
Theres no community, or theres not the right type of community in these places... if I was in a place where people looked after one another it'd make such a thing much easier. Wouldn't even consider abortion/adoption. In a villiage setting the kid could go out on its own, visit the neighbours and all that without said parents having to worry about the childs well being. Must be tough raising a disabled child in a city.
 Super pickney a' run tings.
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