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caramelcurves
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 10:38 |
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Hi all!
You've probably guessed now, I am newly single!!
I am not bitter (now!) But its hard especially as I am the one left with the kids etc, while he swans off and then turns up when he likes and they act like its the 2nd coming of Christ!
The issue here is DATING How do you get out there and regain your confidence with all of these men if you've been with the same (dry-arsed) man for 20 years?
I feel so nervous and expect them to ALL be liars! The approach to women seems to have changed alot, or is this just me? Maybe I am going to the wrong places.
I am 42, young at heart but some places I go to I end up feeling like a snob, as the men want to speak to me as though I am one of their herd! Come on ladies you know the type! 
Whilst others are insistent on telling me what car they drive, how much they earn etc. I don't want either of these! Where are all the men who have gone through real life experiences and are mature enough to be honest about what it is they want, and respectful enought to get it in the right way?
There are so many aspects to being single again. Maybe we can have a laugh about it and help each other with the more serious stuff.
Take care all and look forward to hearing your experiences and words of wisdom!
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blessingfromgod
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 11:08 |
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Hi Caramel....
Maybe you should try and focus on getting to know YOU again, and having fun! I'm not sure how long you have been single for but after being with somebody for 20 years (to me) the natural solution to dating would be to date yourself (if that makes sense) Your post said you are no longer bitter, which suggest's the break up was a bit rocky. I dont know for others but I feel getting to know you again would be a positive step forward especially as there are children involved.
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caramelcurves
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 11:23 |
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Hi there Blessing!
I couldn't agree with you more! I am taking time out to look at myself, and get to know the new me, as I am not the same person as I was when I was last single, especially as I am a mother.
I am very conscious of setting an example for my kids, as I have seen many friends make the mistake of having trailer loads of men in and out of their homes.
I know for a fact that I am not ready to date yet, but when I do go out (rarely), I really can't stand the approach of the men I do encounter. I am quite happy to enjoy my own company for now or just make new "friends".
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blessingfromgod
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 11:38 |
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Cool, in that case welcome to the superficial world of clubs! If that's where you have been encountering these men. Continue to have fun and get to know you, but maybe it is where you are going taht need to change!
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Kunjufu
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 13:11 |
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CC: Hmm two point from a male perspective if i may...
1. As a former singfle parent and currently as the one left [expected] to raise the children without support... My honest advice to you is this, i know its painful sometime when you're struggling away and you're the one sen as the baddie because you're enforcing bounderie.... Then along comes the absent parent and children go wild with excitement... The thing that you need to hold onto, is the assurance that when they get bigger, they will realise who the real parent was, and to whom they owe any opportunities they get in later life... It was that way for me as a child of a single parent and that way me as the father of a now grown up daughter... As i keep telling my wife, thi is about the long game, and not a popularity contest.. as parents we do what we do because its our duty, and if we do it well they [the children] will realise to whom they owe thanks to...if not we can live with the knowledge that we did our best....
2. whilst i haven't been single fo a long time, i still remember when I decided to end my 1st marriage and how isolating it felt, my thoughts learning from that period of my life is this.. don't be desparate, don't force the issue and take your time..it may feel like you don't have it..but it just seems that way... I think looking back that it is far better to develop friendships, develop an interest outside of the home, and life BFG states learn about yourself...
I fopund that going out was great, and envigorating for a time, but the problem i found, looking for relationships out of that polemic, is that you are meeting other single meeting, [a lot equally desparete for love] now unless you get lucky, desparate+desparete=disaster.... What you may find is that there is reason why some people are 'single' at middleage and not all of them are positive.. further from a male perspective, we can smell a desparate women at ten paces...you will get used if you are not careful....
my view is that the best relationships flourish and occur naturally out of a shared interest, like work or a hobby etc...they start off as friendships and go on from there if they are meant...so my advise is to enjoy yourself and se where that takes you before feeling that you HAVE to jump back into the saddle so to speak....
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caramelcurves
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 13:28 |
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LMAO!! I hear ya! I do always think I have some kind of superficial sonar that attracts them!
I am really enjoying time to myself, and don't even know where to go really, I live in London, and there are SO many places to choose from. Where does one go?
I enjoy so many different activities and would like to start going to the non meat market crowd is. If I end up meeting someone it will hopefully be incidental!
I just need to get info on whats on and where to go! Any ideas?
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Kunjufu
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 13:34 |
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CC: can i suggest the theater, The Straford Thether Royal has a good season of BLACK plays, as does the Hackney Empire... I might also suggest maybe leaving dance or African drum classes..that are about..[don't ask me where as i don't have clue]...
Then there is the Comdey clubs springing up all over the place and the spoken word which seems to be growing.... This weekend is African Liberatio Day.. and there is usually an event either in London or the Midlands to commemorate this...
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caramelcurves
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 13:44 |
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Thank you very much for giving your much valued male point of view. I think you are right men "smell" the fear on me! As I am sometimes so threatened by their approach. I think I will look into other activities - interest groups rather than the typical clubs and bars.
Surely there must be other Black men who enjoy travel, gardening, creative writing, music, going for walks or just a good conversation with an intelligent Black woman? I will have to put my ear to the ground now and see what kind of groups there are out there.
Thanks again..I really appreciate your views.
Getting out there and just enjoying myself, in my own time seems the way forward.
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Miss Nellia
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 13:49 |
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Dating is great fun, providing you and your date have SOMETHING in common...... nothing worse than being out with someone and you're dying to get home. A good sign is if the conversation flows naturally, without awkward silent gaps where it is obvious that nerves or boredom is setting in.
Tons of places to go in London, will all depend on what you like to do, I know people with disagree with me but I wouldn't date a man I met in a club or anything like that, and I am only speaking from my own experiences here.
Think about what you like to do to socialise and then go to those places if you are looking to date for fun.
Otherwise you could try my philosophy in life...... don't go looking, when the time is right you two will meet when you dont expect it.
But the best advice was given to you from blessingfromGod, get to know you again before you jump into another relationship first, otherwise your new man will pay for the ex's mistakes.
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Kunjufu
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 13:51 |
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Miss Nellia: actually i totally agree with you I wouldn't date anyone i met in a club or a bar for the first time..that is asking for for a butt kicking...
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Miss Nellia
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 14:09 |
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Glad you agree K, coz in my experience their agenda is always a lil different to mine. lol
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caramelcurves
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 14:27 |
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I think your're right...I think many (males and females) in clubs have a different agenda. Its really hard to get out there and just find my niche, esp as I have kids.
I am about to try making internet friends/penpals, male and female hopefully, and maybe widen my social circle that way!! Though the negative side to that is that the bull takes a little longer to be detected, as opposed to a face to face meet!
On the dating front...I will just let things happen, and as you say Miss Nellia, not go looking! that old saying " If you go looking, all you will find is S**T!"
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Miss Nellia
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 17:01 |
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caramelcurves wrote:
I am about to try making internet friends/penpals, male and female hopefully, and maybe widen my social circle that way!! Though the negative side to that is that the bull takes a little longer to be detected, as opposed to a face to face meet!
hmmm and on the internet dating thing just be very careful as "some" men tend to... lets say exaggerate a little or tend to omit very important things, where as women tend to be more honest and upfront..................... 
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Kunjufu
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 17:03 |
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Some 'men' ...hmmm i don't suppose women lie either..?
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Miss Nellia
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 17:20 |
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@K
LOL was waiting for that.......... , of course they do, but from the feedback I get when friends have come back from these dates is why I said that.
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Proverbs
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 17:50 |
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Hi CC,
I feel for ya!! It must be hard 20 years, and then starting all over again!! My suggestion is get to know guys. Sometimes we too often focus on them as potential partners, boyfriends, or husbands, instead of just getting to know them as friends. If you are single, men can offer women some of the best insights into the dating game. I speak from experience...
You haven't said what you are looking for as a newly single woman! which means you could go with any potential 'flow' except your own!?
caramelcurves wrote: Hi all!
You've probably guessed now, I am newly single!!
I am not bitter (now!) But its hard especially as I am the one left with the kids etc, while he swans off and then turns up when he likes and they act like its the 2nd coming of Christ!
The issue here is DATING How do you get out there and regain your confidence with all of these men if you've been with the same (dry-arsed) man for 20 years?
I feel so nervous and expect them to ALL be liars! The approach to women seems to have changed alot, or is this just me? Maybe I am going to the wrong places.
I am 42, young at heart but some places I go to I end up feeling like a snob, as the men want to speak to me as though I am one of their herd! Come on ladies you know the type!
Whilst others are insistent on telling me what car they drive, how much they earn etc. I don't want either of these! Where are all the men who have gone through real life experiences and are mature enough to be honest about what it is they want, and respectful enought to get it in the right way?
There are so many aspects to being single again. Maybe we can have a laugh about it and help each other with the more serious stuff.
Take care all and look forward to hearing your experiences and words of wisdom!
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comfortandjoy
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 18:15 |
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@ CC
A number of people in this thread have advised you to make friends with new men rather than see them as potential partners. I don't disagree with that at all, in fact that is the best attitude to have towards new people you may meet.
But to save you from disappointment, confusion and frustration, I would just like to warn you that the majority of single men you meet (and some who aren't so single) will NOT be looking at you as a woman they want to be 'friends' with.
Where women are usually quite happy to cultivate new friendships with people of both sexes, especially when single; for men when they meet a woman they like, their interest will usually have a sexual element to it.
In most cases 'friendship' in and of itself is not what men have in mind when they approach you, and they may well view you as a 'time-waster' if you aren't giving them clear signs that you want more than friendship - even in the early stages of getting to know them.
Good luck, you're gonna need it.
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Proverbs
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 20:39 |
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When we meet people of the opposite sex, nobody thinks 'wow he/she would make a good friend'. Its almost always based upon visual representation. We all know that sex does not maintain, or sustain relationships. The key element is friendship. Even if a guy focuses on the 'sexual element' it doesn't mean we have to 'give it up' If anything, that's how you eliminate 'time-wasters' If that's all he looking for, he won't stay around to create a friendship.
All you need is a sense of integrity, self-worth, and confidence, which equates to loving yourself. That in my book is an attractive quality, and guarantees admirers of similar calibre.
comfortandjoy wrote: @ CC
A number of people in this thread have advised you to make friends with new men rather than see them as potential partners. I don't disagree with that at all, in fact that is the best attitude to have towards new people you may meet.
But to save you from disappointment, confusion and frustration, I would just like to warn you that the majority of single men you meet (and some who aren't so single) will NOT be looking at you as a woman they want to be 'friends' with.
Where women are usually quite happy to cultivate new friendships with people of both sexes, especially when single; for men when they meet a woman they like, their interest will usually have a sexual element to it.
In most cases 'friendship' in and of itself is not what men have in mind when they approach you, and they may well view you as a 'time-waster' if you aren't giving them clear signs that you want more than friendship - even in the early stages of getting to know them.
Good luck, you're gonna need it.
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blessingfromgod
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 20:50 |
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Proverbs wrote: When we meet people of the opposite sex, nobody thinks 'wow he/she would make a good friend'. Its almost always based upon visual representation. We all know that sex does not maintain, or sustain relationships. The key element is friendship. Even if a guy focuses on the 'sexual element' it doesn't mean we have to 'give it up' If anything, that's how you eliminate 'time-wasters' If that's all he looking for, he won't stay around to create a friendship.
All you need is a sense of integrity, self-worth, and confidence, which equates to loving yourself. That in my book is an attractive quality, and guarantees admirers of similar calibre.
 Speech! Well said Proverbs, I could not have put it any better. Btw, welcome to the village.
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comfortandjoy
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 21:14 |
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Proverbs wrote: When we meet people of the opposite sex, nobody thinks 'wow he/she would make a good friend'. Its almost always based upon visual representation. We all know that sex does not maintain, or sustain relationships. The key element is friendship. Even if a guy focuses on the 'sexual element' it doesn't mean we have to 'give it up' If anything, that's how you eliminate 'time-wasters' If that's all he looking for, he won't stay around to create a friendship.
All you need is a sense of integrity, self-worth, and confidence, which equates to loving yourself. That in my book is an attractive quality, and guarantees admirers of similar calibre.
What I was trying to say, is that whereas CC may just be happy to meet various men and see them on a friendly, casual, platonic basis; some of those men will expect that if she is agreeing to see them at all, then she has the intention of forming a more intimate, close personal relationship with them, ie she wants to be 'their woman.'
She will be looking at them as just someone she may enjoy doing social things with from time to time - in the short term at least; meanwhile they see that her enjoying their company and being willing to do social things with them means they have actually started 'a relationship' which they believe will lead to more intimacy at some point in the not too distant future. This may not be at all what she has in mind with many (or any!) of these people, especially as she has stated she doesn't intend to rush into another relationship.
So basically, where she is looking to meet new people and go out together with no strings attached until she feels comfortable and ready to move into 'relationship' territory, she needs to bare in mind that some of those new people are looking at these activities as being a period of 'courtship' - with a very specific goal in mind.
Of course there are men who will be prepared to spend time getting to know her simply as a friend with no expectations of anything more, but there are a lot of them who will only be interested in forming a friendship with the expectation that at some point that friendship WILL move on into a full-blown exclusive adult relationship... with all that entails.
Therefore, if she is just about making new friends and socialising for now, but they are at the stage where they are looking for a life partner/wife/that special someone - then that is where the problems could start - and that situation is what I am alerting her to.
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Proverbs
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 21:55 |
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CC made it clear in her inital thread that the issue was about 'dating' A man's assumptions of the woman he may be seeing on a platonic basis is somewhat irrelevant. What, however is relevant is communication. CC is obviously an intelligent woman and her thread indicates she is looking for some honesty from the men she meets.
All too often mixed messages or confusion stem from one or both parties failure to assert what they are looking for, and then wonder why their is a belief that sex is on the menu. Therefore, if one makes their intentions clear from the get-go then assumptions and expectations will dissipate, and both parties will have an understanding of each others wants and needs.
comfortandjoy wrote: Proverbs wrote: When we meet people of the opposite sex, nobody thinks 'wow he/she would make a good friend'. Its almost always based upon visual representation. We all know that sex does not maintain, or sustain relationships. The key element is friendship. Even if a guy focuses on the 'sexual element' it doesn't mean we have to 'give it up' If anything, that's how you eliminate 'time-wasters' If that's all he looking for, he won't stay around to create a friendship.
All you need is a sense of integrity, self-worth, and confidence, which equates to loving yourself. That in my book is an attractive quality, and guarantees admirers of similar calibre.
What I was trying to say, is that whereas CC may just be happy to meet various men and see them on a friendly, casual, platonic basis; some of those men will expect that if she is agreeing to see them at all, then she has the intention of forming a more intimate, close personal relationship with them, ie she wants to be 'their woman.'
She will be looking at them as just someone she may enjoy doing social things with from time to time - in the short term at least; meanwhile they see that her enjoying their company and being willing to do social things with them means they have actually started 'a relationship' which they believe will lead to more intimacy at some point in the not too distant future. This may not be at all what she has in mind with many (or any!) of these people, especially as she has stated she doesn't intend to rush into another relationship.
So basically, where she is looking to meet new people and go out together with no strings attached until she feels comfortable and ready to move into 'relationship' territory, she needs to bare in mind that some of those new people are looking at these activities as being a period of 'courtship' - with a very specific goal in mind.
Of course there are men who will be prepared to spend time getting to know her simply as a friend with no expectations of anything more, but there are a lot of them who will only be interested in forming a friendship with the expectation that at some point that friendship WILL move on into a full-blown exclusive adult relationship... with all that entails.
Therefore, if she is just about making new friends and socialising for now, but they are at the stage where they are looking for a life partner/wife/that special someone - then that is where the problems could start - and that situation is what I am alerting her to.
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comfortandjoy
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Posted: Monday May 28th, 2007 23:22 |
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Proverbs wrote: CC made it clear in her inital thread that the issue was about 'dating' A man's assumptions of the woman he may be seeing on a platonic basis is somewhat irrelevant. Oh I see we have different ideas about what dating is. IMO Dating is a series of casual (platonic) meetings - until things develop further, at which point it becomes a relationship proper. So tell me Proverbs, if CC is going to be 'dating', in your opinion - will a man be correct in thinking what she is looking for is a non-platonic relationship? To me, your mindset as a single person is either (A) "I am looking for someone to get into a relationship with...and am currently interviewing" - non platonic dating. OR (B) "I am looking to meet new people, have fun and widen my social circle/increase my social activity" - platonic dating. CC needs to be clear on what her mindset is when she goes out there 'dating' because although I understand her to mean she is in the (B) mindset and then if the right person comes along while she is in that mode she will consider a relationship - many of those she is encountering will be in the (A) mindset and regardless of what she says, because of their own outlook they will assume that (A) is the only mindset anyone who is dating could be in. What, however is relevant is communication. CC is obviously an intelligent woman and her thread indicates she is looking for some honesty from the men she meets. She is looking for honesty, doesn't mean she'll get honesty. If a man wants her to be his woman, chances are he will play along with her (B) mindset style of dating, thinking that at some point, he will achieve his (A) mindset goal. Communication is key, because what can then happen is that after a few fun outings together when the (A) mindset goal is NOT achieved, the man may feel hurt and as if he has wasted his time 'pursuing' someone who isn't actually dating with the same intentions as himself.
All too often mixed messages or confusion stem from one or both parties failure to assert what they are looking for, and then wonder why their is a belief that sex is on the menu.
Exactly my point. A man may take her out a few times and then - if his mindset is type (A) - assume that they are heading towards a point where they will be in a relationship and having sexual intimacy in future, simply because he really likes her, she appears to enjoy his company and is a single woman. This may not be the case for CC because she may see it as early days and her mindset is (B). Therefore, if one makes their intentions clear from the get-go then assumptions and expectations will dissipate, and both parties will have an understanding of each others wants and needs. It's my belief that even if you are ready to be in a relationship and do want to meet someone for something more serious than simply dating - you may not know this from the get go, and the whole 'getting to know you' process is your opportunity to find out whether this person is someone you want to be with in that way. I don't see dating as anything other than dating - and that's why to me, until you've reached a point where you know for sure that you want more from a particular person - it will be strictly platonic. Not every man she dates will necessarily be the kind of man she will end up wanting to be in a relationship with. She'll take her time, get to know people and THEN decide whether she wants to take things further, not be so clear that she can tell every guy from the get-go whether it will be 'just' dating or lead to something more serious and lasting. Even if CC is upfront and honest, she will no doubt meet men who believe she is really playing a game, playing hard to get, being cool, being coy, being cautious etc; and that is what she needs to be aware of. These men (with A mindset) will appear to accept her position (not really looking for a relationship per se, but open to meeting new people and seeing where it leads - if anywhere) but what will really be happening is that they will have the belief that she IS | | | |
