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Ms Price
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| Joined: | Friday September 16th, 2005 |
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 13:22 |
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Hi everyone
I read an article in a magazine called 'Best' which was left on the seat of the Train last night, not a magazine that i would normally buy... but it had a really intresting article about a good looking mixed-race couple, who had given birth to one black baby and one white baby.
What was strange was that the black baby was darker then they WAS , i mean really darker and even more strange the white baby, was very pale with blond hair and blue eyes. When the mother gave birth to her twins she was told by her white mother that the lighter one's complexion would get darker, as many would know, when some black babies are born some come out near enough to white...however this white baby never gained any colour she just stayed white. The proud parents of the really cute twins tried to seek answers from doctors to find out why the clear difference in skin colour had happend but they could'nt provide them with any, I find that rather strange...However the father of the twins said that he belives because they are both 'mixed race' with two black fathers and two white mothers, obviusly one baby inherited the stronger white gene and one baby inherited the stronger black gene. The mother of the twins before the birth was adement that the babies would come out the same complexion as her and the babies dad seeing how they are both mixed-raced, how wrong was she!!!
I feel sorry for the couple though, because as she was saying, anytime they go out with their babies they have to explain to strangers and family members that the two little girls are sisters and more so twins!! It will be even harder once the two little girls reach school age. Not being a mother myself I have no concept to how a black or mixed race mother would feel about a situation simialr to that, makes you wonder about how complex race is...
Sorry I havent got the article to show just thought it was intresting to share.
One Love
Ms price
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 13:32 |
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lol funny thing is them babies are actually pure...as they come form 2 parents what are the same thing..strange really... I call it "liverpool syndrome" ever been there?
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Ms Price
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 13:42 |
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Black_power wrote: lol funny thing is them babies are actually pure...as they come form 2 parents what are the same thing..strange really... I call it "liverpool syndrome" ever been there?
I know it is really strange and scary esp. if you look at the dynamics of race take the caribbean and latin america for example, no wonder some of latin (black, white anything in between) people don't know who they are...if you saw how pure these babies looked you would'nt be able to believe yr eyes..it was so hard to believe that these babies came from these two parents.
You know i live in the next city across from liverpool, Manchester! and am fully awear of the "syndrome" LOL, it's really common up north, that its the norm.
Ms P
Last edited on Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 13:43 by Ms Price
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Melissa
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 14:10 |
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Terrible!
one of the perils of mix up mix up breeding, how confused those children will turn out to be? Esp the black one when she sees that her TWIN sister gets better treatment than her because of the colour of her skin
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kamkam
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 15:15 |
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| whats "liverpool syndrome"
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 15:51 |
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| take a trip yp there and tell me whats the first thing you notice (apart from the horrible accents)
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Melissa
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 15:57 |
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Liverpool is a very multi-cultural city, there is mass racial intergration, black, white asian living together as one in harmony and inter-breeding at an alarming rate...
its the norm to see mixed couple walking down the street in liverpool WITHOUT axes sticking out out of their heads....
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Afriki
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 17:11 |
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That's really unusual but i've heard of it happening before. My boyfriend and I are both mixed race and have had discussions about this.I think the children will grow up close regardless of their colors because of the twin factor, and they may even welcome their uniqueness in the future. It is sad to think though that there could be difficulties because of this, especially from outside forces.
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 17:39 |
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you never mentioned you had a boyfriend
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Afriki
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 18:04 |
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Black_power wrote:
you never mentioned you had a boyfriend
lol Black_power. I'm sorry, I forgot to include that in my intro, didn't think it was required 
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DJ1
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Posted: Wednesday February 22nd, 2006 18:15 |
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I hate stories like this in the papers, its not abnormal at all, its innevitable, maybe in UK schools should start teaching a bit more on human genetics.
People should read this article
Frank Sweet: The Heredity of Complexion
 "You are wrong about many Puerto Ricans being racially mixed. I once visited Puerto Rico. I saw no mixed-race people there. Everyone I saw was either Black or White." My thesis advisor, a kindly man who encouraged my interest in the history of the "race" notion, replied thus to something I had said.
"This is probably a semantic problem," I tried to explain. "Some people whom you see as White or Black might call themselves mixed."
 "They cannot call themselves something that does not exist," my advisor insisted. "You cannot be a little bit Black, any more than you can be a little bit pregnant or a little bit dead. You are either Black or not. There is no in-between. I should know."
Now folks, we all should know better than to debate semantics. Some readers see that different people can use words differently. They realize that arguing over the "correct" meaning of words like Black or White is pointless because such discussion is sterile and never-ending. But others, sad to say, simply cannot grasp that a word can mean one thing to Johnny but something else entirely to Sally. They will argue forever that Johnny or Sally is just being stubborn.
Oddly, such blindness to semantics is not cured by education. My advisor is a respected historian, a Ph.D. who has published definitive work on U.S. political history. Also, it does not seem to depend on smarts. The most brilliant Black historian publishing today insists that the dictionaries are wrong -- that only White people can be "racist" since "racism" depends on power. Perhaps it depends on fluency in several languages and consequent mental agility regarding word meaning. I do not know. All I know for sure is that some of us see the silliness in semantic arguments, while others do not.
 Nevertheless, set aside my professor's bizarre theory that no mixed-race people can possibly exist. Despite his ill-advised choice of expression, a kernel of honest doubt lurks at the heart of his argument. It is not due to semantic confusion, and it can be cured with education.
What was bothering him is this: if Puerto Ricans have been totally intermarrying (with just as many interracial couples as same-race couples) for at least six generations, why is not everyone light brown? It is true that many Puerto Ricans are light brown. But many are as fair-skinned as any Norwegian and others are as dark as any Nigerian. According to my professor, if mixing had been complete and constant since the PR census of 1850, which recorded a 50-50 Black/White population, then everyone should look blended.
Like most of us, my professor fails to remember his high-school biology. Like most of us, he has forgotten the tale of nineteenth century monk Gregor Mendel's (1822-1884) wrinkled peas and smooth peas. Elementary genetics shows that no large intermarrying 50-50 biracial population will ever blend completely, but will continue to produce about one genetically European child in every eight and one genetically African child in every eight forever. Another way of saying this is that, although most children seem to "blend" their parents' features, if both parents are mixed then one child in four will always be darker than both parents and one in four will always be lighter than both parents.
This phenomenon is neither due to "race" nor to any unique property of melanin heredity. It is independent of how many genes govern complexion. Indeed, it has nothing to do with human beings and applies equally to plants. It has to do with sex, nothing more. It is the inevitable consequence of two basic facts: First, every sexually reproducing organism has two parents. Second, life's DNA is digitally encoded; it is not analog. Hence, every trait is governed by two copies, not one, of the controlling set of genes. One copy inside every cell nucleus came from each parent.
Imagine if complexion were governed by a single gene. (In fact, at least three genes affect complexion, but we shall come back to this in a moment.) In this case, the offspring of a Nigerian and a Norwegian would look in-between (Arab or Berber, say) since the child would have one copy for dark complexion and one for fair. But the child's genes are just as strong as in her parents. They do not dilute. The child's digitally encoded dark gene is just as strong as the Nigerian mother's, and her fair gene is just as strong as that of her Norwegian father. Her blended appearance is not due to any dilution or blending of the parents' genes. It is due to the action of two pure, strong, unblended genes working at cross-purposes.
 Assume now that this child grows up and marries a similarly mixed person. Their offspring will inherit one gene copy from the mixed mother (either pure Nigerian or pure Norwegian, at random) and one from the mixed father (again, either pure Nigerian or pure Norwegian). Work out the probabilities. Out of every four babies in this third generation, two will come out with in-between appearance (like their parents). But one will come out pure Norwegian and one will come out pure Nigerian, like their grandparents. Those who recall high school biology will recognize Mendel's experiments.
One-fourth, one-half, one-fourth. That is Mendel's profoundly important lesson about features that seems to "blend." The first generation will be in-betweens. But the second-generation offspring of two in-betweens will be one-fourth pure "A," one-half in-between, and one-fourth pure "B." One-fourth, one-half, one-fourth. ANY feature. ANY organism. That is the central message of genetics. It is what high school biology classes try to impart. How this simple fact later becomes corrupted inside maturing brains into bizarre notions of "dominance" and "blood ratios" is a mystery of pedagogy. One-fourth, one-half, one-fourth. Remember that.
How do multiple complexion genes change things? If two separate genes affect a trait (each with two copies), then more combinations are possible for the third generation. Out of every sixteen babies in the third generation: One will inherit the Norwegian complexion of its grandfather (four European, zero African genes). Four will have a mid-European complexion (three Europe, one Africa). Six will inherit the Mediterranean complexion of their parents (two Europe, two Africa). Four will have an Ethiopian or San complexion (one Europe, three Africa). And one will inherit the Nigerian complexion of its grandmother (zero Europe, four Africa). Since one-in-sixteen is rare it would, in all likelihood, take an additional generation of selective marriage to produce children of pure Norwegian or Nigerian genetic makeup.
 Since, in reality, at least three genes affect complexion, then the possible combinations are more numerous and it takes yet another generation of intermarriages before the original types are likely to reemerge.
Three points are important. First, no matter how many genes control complexion, no matter how many possible combinations there are, individuals of pure Norwegian and pure Nigerian appearance will inevitably reemerge in every large 50-50 population. Second, one child in four will always be darker than both parents, half will be in between the parents, and one in four will be lighter than both parents. This is independent of how mixed or unmixed you might think the parents are. Draw a straight line from Norway to Nigeria and you will find that complexion change is gradual throughout its length. There is no break. Everyone along the line is mixed to some extent except at the very ends. Of course, this does not mean that two Norwegian-looking parents can have a Nigerian-looking child. It simply means that two Castilian-looking parents have a 25 percent chance of having a child with a northern Iberian appearance (Asturian, say) and an equally small chance of having an Andalusian-looking child. Such small differences gradually accumulate over generations to produce the line's end-points. Third, in the short term, what you see is what you get. A Norwegian appearance (phenotype) results from Norwegian genes (genotype), a Nigerian phenotype results from a Nigerian genotype. There is no lurking invisible Black or White gene that can suddenly pop out.
What about ratio of Negro blood? Forget it. The most exhaustive study of this topic is Caroline Bond Day and Earnest Albert Hooton, A Study of Some Negro-White Families in the United States (Cambridge MA: Harvard University, 1932). This project studied 350 families comprising more than 2,500 photographed individuals. The author, Caroline Bond Day, classified each subject by fraction of "Negro blood" and arranged their photos in family trees, traced all the way back to the original immigrant ancestors from Africa or Europe. (The photos in this article come from her book.) She found that one person in four with 3/8 to 1/2 "Negro blood" could, as she put it, "pass for white." Every person with 1/4 "Negro blood" could do so if they chose: "I know of no case of a quadroon who could not easily pass for white." And people with 1/8 Negro blood or less are, quite simply, white in every way: "In the few examples of octoroons which I have studied I have been able so far to see no traces whatever of Negro admixture."
 The flaw in Ms. Day's analysis was that it was based on the erroneous blending model -- that such terms as "1/2 Negro blood" or "1/4 Negro blood" are meaningful. In fact, as Mendel demonstrated, what matters is not the fraction of "Negro blood," but whether the subject is of the first mixed generation or of a later generation. Fortunately, Ms. Day's misunderstanding was corrected before her book was published. Despite her erroneous hypothesis that fraction of "Negro blood" was significant, Ms. Day had assembled a team of anthropometrists and statisticians (Earnest A. Hooton, Carl Seltzer, Constance Tyler) who measured the facts and reported the rules of thumb given here. They concluded with the following statement: "the evidence here surveyed indicates a Mendelian segregation of skin pigment with multiple factors."
In conclusion, what seemed a paradox to my advisor would be obvious to Gregor Mendel. About one Puerto Rican in eight is as White as any European, both in appearance and in the genes that he or she can bequeath. And about one Puerto Rican in eight is as Black as any African, both in appearance and in the genes that he or she can bequeath. Nevertheless, every Puerto Rican other than recent immigrants has equal numbers of African and European ancestors.
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