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Request for Lesbian and Gay zone
 Moderated by: Saida.M, safetyblitz, Raven, Miss Brighter Days, LadyDay, Kunjufu, Kibibi, Happiness, Dillinger, Breadfruit, Backatya Topic closed

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Kunjufu
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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 12:02
Discuss...without insults if you please..



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 12:15
A gay and lesbian zone here would show an ability to trump ignorance and obsolete laws about what love, sex, and relationship is supposed to entail.

And most importantly, it would validate the homosexual as an actual person and not someone who has to HIDE within the black community. 

The reason why there are so many DL brothers is not a coincidence.  The black community is very unwilling to even acknowledge homosexuals as an actual group of people with feelings, ideas, goals etc. because of the unbelievable denial and hatred towards anyone who dares to be attracted to the same sex. 



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 14:27
Bump...



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 14:53
Think it would be a good idea because then the tired hackneyed arguments are less likely to spill over into other threads.

 

People then have the CHOICE if they want to engage in this dialogue or not.

If not they/I have numerous other forums in which to flex.

And it will just be handy for the Mods to say when these topics arise"take it to the Lesbian Gay Zone"

 

I know someones bound to come on and say"what next a peodophile zone,a sheep shagger zone??? etc etc,when in my view thats an immature approach to take and ends all dialogue-BRAM!

I certainly have my prejudices and if I lived to be 150 they would never change,however African/Black homosexuals are still human beings in my eyes and deserve a modicum of respect on that basis alone.

 

 

Just my two-penneth.:)



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 17:55
no no no no

i mean all the threads that have appeared have been the same or lead to the same thing.

 



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 18:09
I think it's ok as an idea if only because then I don't have to see it as JB says.  It's like the gay section in a bookshop.  I see the big sign so I don't go there.



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 18:13

Last edited on Sunday March 5th, 2006 14:35 by



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 18:27
BlackMatta wrote: What would be the nature of such a zone?

Would it be like the Men's and Women's forums where, if requested, the opposite sex, will not be allowed to contribute? i.e a preserve of gay and lesbian people, or a forum where gay and lesbian issues can be debated by anybody any time?

Also, how do lesbian and gay issues rank against other issues that have no forum? (Where is our general philosophy forum!).


Personally I would like an Existentialist Zone but I guess I could never be really sure if it was a figment of my imagination or if someone else was dreaming it....????



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 18:32
*Jett adopts the persona of a knuckle scraping male for the purposes of this thread*

 

 

Yeah I think the idea of this Zone is great,but it should be for Lesbians only and they should only post details of their Carpet munching exploits. Slowly and with explicit detail...pictures optional.



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 18:39
offtopic.gif @ JB

I've never understood why so-called hetero men would find lesbianism interesting confused3  I think it's a white man fetish myself though...



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 18:43
DrunkMonkey wrote: offtopic.gif @ JB

I've never understood why so-called hetero men would find lesbianism interesting confused3  I think it's a white man fetish myself though...


 

A-ha that is a question which could be debated till the end of time but i'm not gonna go there because Kunjufu will have kittens if this thread goes off topic. I only added my post for comic relief.;)

 

Anyway forum...........as you were.:)





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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 18:59
how would such a zone benefit the wider bnv. in what way would it add to this site?

im still a no



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 19:21
LadyDay wrote: how would such a zone benefit the wider bnv. in what way would it add to this site?

im still a no
Well you know the under 18's forum doesnt really benefit me either but its there.I dont care about teenagers-when I say I dont  thats a bit harsh-but that calibre of posting I can hear on the back of any bus when school lets out.


If I wanna know whose endz is betta dan di next or wot lite skinned gyal is crisser than the next or how I dont fancy this one coz dey is 2 Blik,I shall make use of my bus pass.



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 20:14
bighairlol @ Jett Black

 

Can anyone help me with directions towards the 'Sheep Shagger Zone' please.

 

Not sure about the answer to Gay/Lesbian section as im not sure whether its more effective as a concept to keep 'Straight' and 'Gay' meduims seperate. The issue of whether the demand warrants it is also obviously key.



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 20:56
A gay and lesbian zone here would show an ability to trump ignorance and obsolete laws about what love, sex, and relationship is supposed to entail.

 

Maybe we should appeal to every minority view and have a bleachers section so those who want to discuss the merits of various bleaching creams can do so/ even thoough its a minority view.

Maybe that will trump the ignorance about people who want to bleach? We can be more understanding eh?


 



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:10
Who exactly would post there? I didn't think their were gay elements in BNV. Or are we just talking issue relating to gay people, and don't we have enough threads concerning that.

We should follow the stance of African countries and that of the wider diaspora who are unaffected by liberal whit media: It's not part of our culture, and hence has no relevance.



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:20
No I don't think a lesbian/gay forum is necessary. Where would it stop? Seperate forums for everything?

Nah too many forums as it is.

Besides this is a cultural website for us Africans.

If we allow this, I think some may view it as a 'gay' site and there are plenty of those already.

All those who are interested in that per se should go to them or build up a site of their own to cater for that taste.

Leave us to talk about it in the 'normal' forums in smallish doses as we are now.

I think that if that forum came about, the people using it would use it to push their agenda and that is they'd want more and more of 'blacknet' to become more gay centric.

I could see some of them sqealing now: "why should we be seperate: we are being picked on: we should be on ALL the forums..."blkdemon

And if that happens, as well as their gay/lesbian forum, blacknet may well in the end resemble gaynet.



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:21
Deleted

Last edited on Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:45 by



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:42
athaba wrote:
All those who are interested in that per se should go to them or build up a site of their own to cater for that taste.


blkclap My sentiments exactly

*I was actually going to ask Timeline why she hasnt set up her own website pandering to the Gay/Lesbian/Transgender audience, if she is soo down for the cause*



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:48
I'm deliberately not entering my views into this debate..however can i say as a point of clarification..the sole purpose of setting up any new forum would be to engage, and proactively include all members into that subject matter...

The purpose of forums is NOT to segregate, Ghettoise, corner off or separate ourselves from a perspective...otherwise what would be the point?



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:49
Better yet, bring back the dust bin and make it postable, that way people can discuss issue of that nature there.

Nothing wrong with givin em fringe status..



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:52
Kunjufu wrote: I'm deliberately not entering my views into this debate..however can i say as a point of clarification..the sole purpose of setting up any new forum would be to engage, and proactively include all members into that subject matter...

The purpose of forums is NOT to segregate, Ghettoise, corner off or separate ourselves from a perspective...otherwise what would be the point?


Then I join with others in my objection.  If maginalisation and containment is not the objective then I strongly think it's a wrong move for the village to go down that route.



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 Posted: Saturday January 28th, 2006 22:54
Timeline wrote: A gay and lesbian zone here would show an ability to trump ignorance and obsolete laws about what love, sex, and relationship is supposed to entail.

And most importantly, it would validate the homosexual as an actual person and not someone who has to HIDE within the black community. 

The reason why there are so many DL brothers is not a coincidence.  The black community is very unwilling to even acknowledge homosexuals as an actual group of people with feelings, ideas, goals etc. because of the unbelievable denial and hatred towards anyone who dares to be attracted to the same sex. 






I repost the proposal for this idea..did anyone actually read this?



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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 00:18
@Timeline said "Timeline wrote: A gay and lesbian zone here would show an ability to trump ignorance and obsolete laws about what love, sex, and relationship is supposed to entail.
------------------------------------------------------------------


That does not actually follow or make sense in fact it seems like a conclusion first then an attempt to build an argument afterwards...

In other words if you do not give me what I am calling for you must ipso facto be ignorant...Tolerance or acceptance does not mean what Timline wants or suggests...It can mean accepting that there is sexual differences and acknowledging them in a range of ways, without giving them a platform or institutionalizing that difference.

In fact as we know from facts once you institutionalize that difference you then create the basis and the rationale for more.

In fact you would weaken your basis for denying other factions within the gay community for their own space. Because if anybody took the time to study this community, they will know they are not homogoenous, far from and they are as hostile to each other and from others trying to respresent them  than as if heterosexuals were doing it.

-

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And most importantly, it would validate the homosexual as an actual person and not someone who has to HIDE within the black community. 


First the notion or distinction between public and private exists in every known society to human kind and to heterosexuals as much to anybody else, of course given that humanity is essentially heterosexual we are given more slack or scope but only so much. Black people cannot express sexuality at work, try being a black man for day and tell me how accepting people are of your cultural and gender identity....

Every society has a clear notion of what is acceptable public or private behaviour and for what groups of people. A bit like kissing black girls in my day and still now to a large degree. No decent girl would allow you to kiss her on the street. Whether you are from Jamaica or any part of the Caribbean, Nigeria, Ghana, Senegal, South Africa. I have never known anyone from these parts and women in particular who would allow you to kiss her in the streets in public. .Shared cultural sense of private and public behaviour.

So everybody has to hide or withold parts of their self in any civilised society. In fact you can have more freedom in expressing yourself in the work place being gay than the average African male or female.


The reason why there are so many DL brothers is not a coincidence.  The black community is very unwilling to even acknowledge homosexuals as an actual group of people with feelings, ideas, goals etc. because of the unbelievable denial and hatred towards anyone who dares to be attracted to the same sex. 

I can guarentee you that the notion of people not accepting public homosexuality in the US has no relations to hatred because if it is being suggested in the hundreds of years African-Americans were not aware of gays in their midsts, then the sister is clearly drunk and there is no evidence of black people having or demonstrating hatred to gays. Just disproval and issues around public conduct..

As they say in the US don't get it twisted.confused3

 

FBconfused3






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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 00:26
Kunjufu wrote: Timeline wrote: A gay and lesbian zone here would show an ability to trump ignorance and obsolete laws about what love, sex, and relationship is supposed to entail.

And most importantly, it would validate the homosexual as an actual person and not someone who has to HIDE within the black community. 

The reason why there are so many DL brothers is not a coincidence.  The black community is very unwilling to even acknowledge homosexuals as an actual group of people with feelings, ideas, goals etc. because of the unbelievable denial and hatred towards anyone who dares to be attracted to the same sex. 










I repost the proposal for this idea..did anyone actually read this?

 

Gay folk are not a 20th/21st century phenomena they have been around from time,statistically they probably comprise-conservatively-10% of our population,thats a lot of folk that we are treating like they have plague(don't rebutt that point it's beneath you)......anyhow this forum may never get off the ground and even if it did African Gay folk would probably be hesistant to post there given the strength of feeling .

It leaves me slightly uneasy that there may be some brilliant minds out there who are afraid to speak up because of the cards they have been dealt.

As much as I have verbally said I am repulsed by the sex I can seperate that in my mind for  dialogue.

I cant see a Gay agenda being pushed here,it just wouldnt happen but at the same time it's foolhardy to pretend that these men and women don't exist.

Ultimately I would embrace it if it were here but if not i'm not gonna lose sleep over it either.





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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 00:30
Jettblack

Why would those "great minds" be turned off commenting on things that have nothing to do with the limited scope of homosexuality?  Why would you even have to mention it?

It's an annonymous message board.  People only know you're gay if you say so.  Same in real life.  People only know if you act like a queen.  Not all gays do.

If you're gonna discuss politics, history or whatever topic your "great minds" want to discuss then I can't see why they would mention their sexuality at all.



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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 00:41
DrunkMonkey wrote: Jettblack

Why would those "great minds" be turned off commenting on things that have nothing to do with the limited scope of homosexuality?  Why would you even have to mention it?

It's an annonymous message board.  People only know you're gay if you say so.  Same in real life.  People only know if you act like a queen.  Not all gays do.

If you're gonna discuss politics, history or whatever topic your "great minds" want to discuss then I can't see why they would mention their sexuality at all.


I'm sure there are 10's or 20's of those great minds already reading and or posting on Blacknet.

But I mean those great minds talking in regard to their status being able to properly convey what it is to be African and Gay without all the same tired shout-downs and batty bwoy haffi dead talk.

It's not gonna sway me but id certainly be more sympathetic if someone finally offered up some on point dialogue.Coz everything which has ever been written on here has made me close off my ears even more.



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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 00:50
Well if that's what you're after you could seek them out on their websites and engage with them.  I don't need to hear intelligence or ignorance to empathise or sympathis with them because I'm not about to do either.

I have no problem talking to gays about neutral subjects.  I don't see the relevance or necessity of their sexuality being brought up.



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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 00:57
DrunkMonkey wrote: Well if that's what you're after you could seek them out on their websites and engage with them.  I don't need to hear intelligence or ignorance to empathise or sympathis with them because I'm not about to do either.

I have no problem talking to gays about neutral subjects.  I don't see the relevance or necessity of their sexuality being brought up.


Thats fair enough but I doubt i'll be frequenting any Gay websites and I wouldnt even no where to begin.Besides I have enough on my plate reading the stuff on Ligali and BNV.

Well we can go on pretending that it doesnt exist and we can have another generation of women getting infected,getting their hearts broken etc because they believe all African men are uber-macho and thugged out without a Gay bone in their bodies.

I'm passing round the blinkers now.:cool:

The futures so bright I gotta wear shades.confused3



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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 01:04
It's not about pretending they don't exist.  They clearly do as for uber males have you seen Camron lately?

Anyway it's about what we accept as part of normal and standard culture for us.  I don't think that this sort of thing should be made to seem as if it's just another ok thing that people do.  It's not.  There is nothing wrong with stigma and shame where it is needed.

There is not enough stigma and shame in todays society.



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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 01:12
DrunkMonkey wrote: It's not about pretending they don't exist.  They clearly do as for uber males have you seen Camron lately?

Anyway it's about what we accept as part of normal and standard culture for us.  I don't think that this sort of thing should be made to seem as if it's just another ok thing that people do.  It's not.  There is nothing wrong with stigma and shame where it is needed.

There is not enough stigma and shame in todays society.


Ok,i'm bowing out of this one at the moment as i'm on Whitney Houston death watch.............til next time.



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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 01:19
Um too subtle a reference for me confused3

One thing before you go though jett black

How is having a gay forum on bn gonna stop dl fools?  It's still annonymous!!!



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 Posted: Sunday January 29th, 2006 01:36