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LadyDay
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Posted: Wednesday March 21st, 2007 23:50 |
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saw these guys on dragons den. so i googled them being it was 2 brothers
check their site out
they didnt get any funding from the den though
http://www.suavemagazine.co.uk/
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Le Moor
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Posted: Thursday March 22nd, 2007 00:34 |
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LadyDay wrote: saw these guys on dragons den. so i googled them being it was 2 brothers
check their site out
they didnt get any funding from the den though
http://www.suavemagazine.co.uk/
Hmmmmm.
Didnt they say they market to black entrepeneurs and businessman.
There are two million black people in this country and i estimate that less than 5% of us are wealthy entrepeneurs and businessman. Thats a target market of 100,000 UK people at best. This number should be the weekly sales count and not the audience potential. The figures just dont stack up enough for advertisers, sales or the publishers high overheads, which come standard with this business.
In the States these businesses can work. Here its severely niche. Not impossible but as good as.
Last edited on Thursday March 22nd, 2007 00:38 by Le Moor
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Dada
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Posted: Thursday March 22nd, 2007 01:13 |
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I read GQ from time to time so a cross over may be possible, I used to love "Untold" Magazine.
Maybe they should read my Post on Private Equity but judging from the number of post I dare say the interest they like the rest of the Community in business are well capitalised.
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Le Moor
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Posted: Thursday March 22nd, 2007 01:31 |
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Dada wrote: I read GQ from time to time so a cross over may be possible, I used to love "Untold" Magazine.
Maybe they should read my Post on Private Equity but judging from the number of post I dare say the interest they like the rest of the Community in business are well capitalised.
A cross over to white people can only happen significantly imo, if you no longer target black people. That changes the entire dynamic and you are then competing with the established big boys.
Niche markets can work but the figures have to stack up and the stratergy has to be perfect. They may have other ideas such as an overall business plan which inludes an e-commerce proposal for e.g.
Thats not how they presented it on the show though.
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Apedemak
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Posted: Thursday March 22nd, 2007 12:00 |
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Looks intresting, I'd buy it.
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Dada
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Posted: Thursday March 22nd, 2007 22:05 |
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La Moor,
An example of a good cross over into the main stream has to be Mr Dennis's Kung Fu magazine from the 70's it was not only Hong Kong people buying into that.
Black people are famous for our sense of style and culture which has always been very leading edge and turns into main stream. Many of the Fashions and Music and etc is lapped up by the mainstream so provided one simply presents in an assumptive manner which Europeans do all the time, one may get a way with it depending on how it's marketed.
Many brands may see the publication as place to place their brand to give it credibility etc. ..........must dash I am cooking.
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Le Moor
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Posted: Friday March 23rd, 2007 00:33 |
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Dada wrote: La Moor,
An example of a good cross over into the main stream has to be Mr Dennis's Kung Fu magazine from the 70's it was not only Hong Kong people buying into that.
Kungfu is a good example of a niche market, but even these type magazines are Ltd in potential and commercial attraction. Large publishers with several titles can entertain these type magazines as they have the funds to brand the mag etc. They can sell globally or at least nationally which would hit the right numbers for it to be anywhere near successful. Anything else outside of this is hardly going to set the world allight in terms of revenue potential and actual return. Wouldnt surprise me if some enthausiats publish and distribute the mag, and break even just for the sheer love of it.
Investors want more than this however, a lot more..
Suave Magazine is targetted to black business and black enterpeneurs. Somehow i dont see the white business sector being ready to concern themselves with our business issues more so than their beloved Forbes Magazine or Money Marketing Magaazine etc. There is no cross over there and ill just call that an instinctive observation. How many white people buy Pride magazine or the Voice or the New Nation?. So why because its targeting businesses would the result be any different?  Its still a target market consisting of black people. The only way you would possibly do so is to take away the BLACK target market and make it for the business fraternity. However then, as i said earlier, you have entered the playing feild of stern competition.
Black people are famous for our sense of style and culture which has always been very leading edge and turns into main stream. Many of the Fashions and Music and etc is lapped up by the mainstream so provided one simply presents in an assumptive manner which Europeans do all the time, one may get a way with it depending on how it's marketed.
Yes we are but this is not a fashion magazine it is a business publication as far as i was aware. Plus also the reality is, we are not renowned in the same way for our business acumen, are we?
Many brands may see the publication as place to place their brand to give it credibility etc. ..........must dash I am cooking.
Bet its nowhere near as nice as the Stew Chicken i just boxed down from West Green Road.
Dada credibility is all important to brands. When a publication is new the brands often give it credibility and not the opposite. This is why new publications can take time, and deep pockets, before a profit is returned. Before a medium has built up a verified audience and a credible reputation it struggles to command a high commercial value and often gives away its advertising at a loss.
The biggest reason i feel these guys never got the funding they were seeking was because every Dragon instantly knew that publishing is a very high cost/overheads business, therefore massive potential for failure. Unless they were walking in saying that they already had 100,000 subscriptions or sales it was never going to happen. Even a mainstream publishing idea woould probably not cut it with them for the exact same reasons, unless there was a unique selling point that caught their attentions.
Last edited on Friday March 23rd, 2007 00:55 by Le Moor
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balboa
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Posted: Friday March 23rd, 2007 11:51 |
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i have 2 say, it looks gud tho. id propably buy it
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Judge J
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Posted: Friday March 23rd, 2007 12:49 |
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| I might have to venture to the head office of this magazine and purchase a copy
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Dada
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Posted: Tuesday March 27th, 2007 00:03 |
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There is a BIG drive at the moment within the Advertising industry and Media Buyers for targeting Ethnic Minorities. This drive started to gather momentum about four years ago, and is still being waged. So in respect to advertisers they are there and are willing.
In respect to Business and the Black Community. I reluctantly have to agree with you. As black people, our presence as successful business men and woman is woefully low. Being out paced by minstrels in sport and entertainment.
However, the point I make is that when reading the likes of GQ or Forbes neither states it's a white publication it is assumed that the publication is judged on it's content and the pictures that are in are coincidental (that most are white male and middle aged).
In regards to investment please read the topic I made on Private Equity. If such a business plan came across a Private Equity Company's desk provided they could "Show them the Money" they would assist them in trying to reach out through content to a broader audience.
Investors want more than this however, a lot more..
That needs to be qualified. For example it depends on the amount of investment V.C investing £100 Million pounds, yes. A Business Angel investing £100,00 not really, if they are from a Publishing background, God know theres money in it ( Murduch, Black, Heseltine , Dennis etc) then that investor will be prepared to give mentoring and experience in equal measure.
Trust me you would be amazed who get money and how they select.
Your point about the Publication Pride is valid but New Nation or Voice not as both proclaim to be "Black" Newspapers for a strictly Black audience. Pride Magazine is a quality one but as you point out there is much competition in the Womens sector to keep it firmly in "it's place".
The old adage: "The Medium is the Message" holds true and provided it fits a brands profile it will advertise in it. This was happening in UNTOLD magazine just before the plug was pulled. Probably not capitalised well enough. That is also why many mainstream advertisers used to use fly posting to advertise to give thier brand "Street Cred" the same goes for the Major brands advertising on "Youtube" .
In respect to Black Business. There are many great opportunities in Africa that Western Businesses would love to be aware of but the mainstream doe's not allow it on the radar. A publication that highlighted such opportunities that are in Africa or the Carribbean even would be a source of great interest to those looking for a high yield on a low investment.
Maybe what I am talking about is not apart of Suave Magazine's
remitt but we must refrain from pigeon holing ourselves and business to our community only, The asians don't damn they even have the market wrapped up selling our food & cosmetics back to us.
Back to publishing. In publishing their are two Universities in my book.
The EMaps, and Conde Nest of this world and the Old School Stirling Publications. One is about Style and Content, the other about Good Media Salesman or Women.
If one is in Publishing and your are generating sales revenue you had better have a clear message to the person on the other end of the Table\Board room or telephone.
When you say:
Wouldnt surprise me if some enthausiats publish and distribute the mag, and break even just for the sheer love of it.
That's one very good reason to start a business. Too many budding entrepreneurs waste time trying to reinvent the wheel, the BIG Idea etc. What's starbucks but a coffee cafe, nothing new in that save the concept of a lifestyle.
While the Dragons den is entertaining. It's not real life.
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Dada
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Posted: Tuesday March 27th, 2007 00:03 |
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There is a BIG drive at the moment within the Advertising industry and Media Buyers for targeting Ethnic Minorities. This drive started to gather momentum about four years ago, and is still being waged. So in respect to advertisers they are there and are willing.
Marketing industry catering to non-white communities in UK
Feb 10, 2004: The Asian and black communities in Britain have disposable incomes worth 32bn pound, and the mainstream advertising industry is slowly recognising this. The number of advertising campaigns using ethnic minority actors trebled last year as the marketing industry woke up to the power of the ‘brown pound’ — the purchasing power of the non-white communities. One of the most visible black figures is Halifax’s Howard Brown, but NatWest and KFC campaigns have also recently featured Asian or black actors. In January ‘03, only 2% of campaigns featured black and Asian people, but that rose to 7% by November last year, according to the Institute of Practitioners in Advertising (IPA).
The IPA said ethnic minorities had more disposable income than ever before. Peugeot is another advertiser that turned its attention to the brown pound, using an Indian to help attract Asian buyers for its 206 model. The IPA said it had been campaigning to encourage advertisers to include ethnic minorities in campaigns in the same way it had pushed the ‘pink pound’ or ‘grey pound’. Anjna Raheja, managing director of Media Moguls, a marketing group that helps brands reach ethnic minority consumers, said advertising agencies still had to be more inclusive when creating campaigns. The institute is also trying to encourage more people from ethnic backgrounds to consider a career in marketing. At present, only 4% of employees at marketing companies are from ethnic backgrounds and 70% of that total work in supporting roles, rather than the more glamorous creative field.
Back to my own words:
In respect to Business and the Black Community. I reluctantly have to agree with you. As black people, our presence as successful business men and woman is woefully low. Being out paced by minstrels in sport and entertainment.
However, the point I make is that when reading the likes of GQ or Forbes neither states it's a white publication it is assumed that the publication is judged on it's content and the pictures that are in are coincidental (that most are white male and middle aged).
In regards to investment please read the topic I made on Private Equity. If such a business plan came across a Private Equity Company's desk provided they could "Show them the Money" they would assist them in trying to reach out through content to a broader audience.
Investors want more than this however, a lot more..
That needs to be qualified. For example it depends on the amount of investment V.C investing £100 Million pounds, yes. A Business Angel investing £100,00 not really, if they are from a Publishing background, God know theres money in it ( Murduch, Black, Heseltine , Dennis etc) then that investor will be prepared to give mentoring and experience in equal measure.
Trust me you would be amazed who get money and how they select.
Your point about the Publication Pride is valid but New Nation or Voice not as both proclaim to be "Black" Newspapers for a strictly Black audience. Pride Magazine is a quality one but as you point out there is much competition in the Womens sector to keep it firmly in "it's place".
The old adage: "The Medium is the Message" holds true and provided it fits a brands profile it will advertise in it. This was happening in UNTOLD magazine just before the plug was pulled. Probably not capitalised well enough. That is also why many mainstream advertisers used to use fly posting to advertise to give thier brand "Street Cred" the same goes for the Major brands advertising on "Youtube" .
In respect to Black Business. There are many great opportunities in Africa that Western Businesses would love to be aware of but the mainstream doe's not allow it on the radar. A publication that highlighted such opportunities that are in Africa or the Carribbean even would be a source of great interest to those looking for a high yield on a low investment.
Maybe what I am talking about is not apart of Suave Magazine's
remitt but we must refrain from pigeon holing ourselves and business to our community only, The asians don't give a damn,they even have the market wrapped up selling our food & cosmetics back to us.
Back to publishing. In publishing their are two Universities in my book.
The old IPC, and Conde Neste of this world and the Old School Stirling Publications. One is about Style and Content, the other about Good Media Salesman or Women.
If one is in Publishing and your are generating sales revenue you had better have a clear message to the person on the other end of the TableBoard room or telephone.
When you say:
Wouldnt surprise me if some enthausiats publish and distribute the mag, and break even just for the sheer love of it.
That's one very good reason to start a business. Too many budding entrepreneurs waste time trying to reinvent the wheel, the BIG Idea etc. What's starbucks but a coffee cafe, nothing new in that save the concept of a lifestyle.
While the Dragons den is entertaining. It's not real life.
Last edited on Tuesday March 27th, 2007 01:35 by Dada
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blackprofessional
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Posted: Friday March 30th, 2007 23:42 |
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As a representative of Suave Magazine, I would like to clarify that there is target market and there is readership. Obviously you will have the core target market but lets not forget that you don’t have to be a “professional� or an “entrepreneur� to read it.
We as black people are aspirational . Â Why do we have to get caught up in categories?. Â Being a lifestyle with business magazine will interest the wider black community, it will present role models it has a positive spin to what is going on in the community which is needed.
[size=I]wouldn’t compare this to a Kung FU niche magazine or Forbes. This goes deeper than the general magazine, we are focusing on our progressive spirit, the ways in which we have overcome all barriers, all discrimination and hurdles to achieve in different ways.]
The magazine has a message and this message is useful if you are a single parent on benefits and are looking for a job, if you are 18 and interested in a career, if you are 35 and seeking funding. Black people as professional and in  business is niche, black people interested in a positive lifestyle is general and Suave Magazine intends to showcase both aspects so that people recognize us as serious- in the mainstream. ]
[size=Â ]
[size=I]f you are interested to know more, Suave magazine is having a networking event on the 7th of April at the Crowne Plaza in Canary Wharf . See Suavemagazine.co.uk (events) for more details.
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Dada
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Posted: Saturday March 31st, 2007 11:34 |
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You would do well to ask the Executive Professional Network to allow you to target their list of 5,000 members.
Good Luck. Wish you every success.
Dont' do what Pride Magazine has done and have a special British issue at a time when the community is commorating slavery.
P.S
Your Networking Evening is it a Networking Evening - in the sense that the time will be for making actual business contacts or one where a couple of speakers are simply giving it the Big I am, then 5 mins of networking before the tube closes?
Last edited on Saturday March 31st, 2007 11:37 by Dada
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Le Moor
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Posted: Sunday April 1st, 2007 22:25 |
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blackprofessional wrote: As a representative of Suave Magazine, I would like to clarify that there is target market and there is readership. Obviously you will have the core target market but lets not forget that you don’t have to be a “professional� or an “entrepreneur� to read it.
We as black people are aspirational . Why do we have to get caught up in categories?. Being a lifestyle with business magazine will interest the wider black community, it will present role models it has a positive spin to what is going on in the community which is needed.
[size=I]wouldn’t compare this to a Kung FU niche magazine or Forbes. This goes deeper than the general magazine, we are focusing on our progressive spirit, the ways in which we have overcome all barriers, all discrimination and hurdles to achieve in different ways.]
The magazine has a message and this message is useful if you are a single parent on benefits and are looking for a job, if you are 18 and interested in a career, if you are 35 and seeking funding. Black people as professional and in business is niche, black people interested in a positive lifestyle is general and Suave Magazine intends to showcase both aspects so that people recognize us as serious- in the mainstream. ]
[size= ]
[size=I]f you are interested to know more, Suave magazine is having a networking event on the 7th of April at the Crowne Plaza in Canary Wharf . See Suavemagazine.co.uk (events) for more details.
Good luck with the Magazine.
I am slightly confused though.
On the show the two guys specifically said that they were targetting black entrepeneurs. You're now saying that its a lifestyle come business maagzine. You then went on to say that your core target market is proffessional entrepeneurs, but you expect to have C2DEs reading as well. Exactly how does this work?
Im confused as to exactly what is the direction of the magazine and what type of advertiser will it attract? Is it going to be editoral that will appeal to Businessman or singe parents on benefits? .
You've also said you dont have to be an entrpreneur to read it but when you were asking for funding it was the key element to your pitch.
Exactly which direction is the magazine targetted towards?
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blackprofessional
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Posted: Sunday April 1st, 2007 23:17 |
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For all serious business people..
Suave magazine would like to invite your company to supply a sample of your product free of charge in our goodie bag for our next
SUAVE PROFESSIONAL BUSINESS NETWORK EVENT
Suave Professional Networking Event is the most-effective professional networking event for professionals and entrepreneurs
taking place on Saturday the 7th of April at
Crown Plaza Hotel Docklands ExCeL Marina Western Gateway Royal Victoria Dock London E16 1AL
We supply goodie bags to :
Professionals
Decision-makers
Influencers
Executives
Entrepreneurs
Partners and students
who will be visiting our events.
We strive to do all we can to help our customers with their requirements. We’ve sourced hundreds of wonderful goodies, matched themes and styles, worked to tight lead times and we always make sure that the finished product is presented perfectly. The result – our goodie bags exceed expectations and our customers are always delighted. Your company’s name or logo – everything is tailored to your unique requirements.
For more information
http://www.suavemagazine.co.uk/events/views/39/suave_professional_networking_event
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Posted: Sunday April 1st, 2007 23:22 |
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| As mentioned previously if you are business minded and aspiring- you can read Suave. The magazine has no class or status barriers, in this world anyone can be someone and if you have an ambition then you can read about others and follow.
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LadyDay
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Posted: Tuesday April 3rd, 2007 10:08 |
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@blackprofessional welcome to the village
feel free to contribute to various debates.
good luck with your business, you seem passionate nd i am sure you will do fine
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Posted: Tuesday April 3rd, 2007 12:02 |
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I think UNTOLD was an interesting case study of the potential and limitations of this kind of publication. If it were to be launched now, I think its chances of success would be greater than they were when it was initially launched, as the gap its seeking to fill is recognised now in a way it was not ten years ago.
I think something of the same applies to Suave - it doesn't fit neatly into the established 'segments' that marketing types use to analyse a product or service. Doesn't mean it won't work, and at least it isn't burdened with the fixed cost of having to produce and distribute a (glossy) paper publication.
Think the brand needs some profile, and in today's world celebrity endorsement is the route that many will choose - might be something in that. There is also the questions of how much crossover appeal the mag will have - as others have said, if it's only aiming at a relatively small market in terms of 'buyership', its too limiting. In this case VIBE magazine might be an example to follow (not advocating it personally, but it makes the point).
It's been tried before - let's hope we have a success with this, and one that's around for the long term.
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Posted: Tuesday April 3rd, 2007 12:05 |
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| I second that. Soul Rebel
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Le Moor
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Posted: Tuesday April 3rd, 2007 22:44 |
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blackprofessional wrote: As mentioned previously if you are business minded and aspiring- you can read Suave. The magazine has no class or status barriers, in this world anyone can be someone and if you have an ambition then you can read about others and follow.
BP, with all due respect, this again sounds like an emotional answer.
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Le Moor
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Posted: Wednesday April 4th, 2007 07:24 |
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SoulRebel wrote: I think something of the same applies to Suave - it doesn't fit neatly into the established 'segments' that marketing types use to analyse a product or service. Doesn't mean it won't work, and at least it isn't burdened with the fixed cost of having to produce and distribute a (glossy) paper publication.
Im not so sure. Why i have a bee in my bonet about this one is because i find media particualary ineresting and also because im convinced that becuase our target market in the UK is so diluted, to achieve success in this area is virtually impossible. It can be done but you would probably need a universal theme such as hair, skin products etc. I do however hope on this occasion im proved wrong and sincerely mean that. Theres something quite not right about opposing this as it feels im willing my own pepes to fail, which is so far from the truth.
Emotion and sound business practices are often confused but are in fact often worlds apart in terms of achieving success. This magazines outlook and direction at first glance would appear just emotional.
Suave magazine DOES in fact fit neatly into a catogory. Why would it deserve the special privilage to defy marketing laws, which at the moment it sounds like they are flouting. Initially it may not do so as the 'suck it and see' factor may generate interest from all angles, however eventually marketing principles, just like gravity, will bring unsound practices crashing back down to earth. This to me would be the mistake in thinking you can target all demographics with a business publication. It doesnt make sense or add up. It doesnt make sense that you would target a black business market in the UK full stop, the numbers just dont work.
If Suave havent really explained themselves properly then this is a different isse. Either that or they WILL change their tune eventually and the LIFESTLYE part of the magazine will become the prime focus. Then they will be competing with the likes of PRIDE mag who i dont think have ever set the world alight in terms of sal |
